Draft recommendations from the 2015 Names Policy Panel

[David Goldstein]

that reminds me of another classic comment

i'll say it again ! i'm not against .au, i'm against the way it would be implemented.
tim

You have no idea how second level domains would be implemented, if it is recommended by the Panel as no model has been agreed on. If the Panel recommends second level registrations, then the Board will consider it and if the Board approves it the model will then be discussed. The Panel may make suggestions, but that's all they can be.

I really wish people would stop making ignorant comments and understand the process.

 

[David Goldstein]

David you have debunked nothing but your own invalid points. All your posts have done is brought to light many more serious questions and concerns.

You also really should have put on a disclaimer on your posts and possibly signature about your roles on the Auda Panel, author of the Auda Newsletter and that Auda is your client so you say on your own websites etc. This may assist readers to understand the views you are expressing and how they may form your voting intensions and decision making.

You would have to agree it has caused valid concerns about impartiality or at least your wish to be open to listening to others opinions?

Anyone who knows anything about domain names from the registry/registrar side of things in .au knows auDA is a client of mine and has been for over a decade. And this is my third Panel I've been on. Each time I have supported second level registrations, but this time probably due to changes with .nz and .uk there is more support.

As for suggestions auDA wants this change, I challenge anyone to show where there is evidence of this. I have no idea what any auDA staff prefer. Nor is there any evidence of an organisational position. So to suggest I could possibly be conflicted is bizarre.

Still, it's long been viewed that this forum doesn't really deal with facts and this thread just confirms this.

 

[Andrew Wright]

So no matter that international evidence shows you're wrong you'll keep peddling the snake oil...

Can you provide some links to evidence please?

 

[findtim]

You have no idea how second level domains would be implemented, if it is recommended by the Panel as no model has been agreed on.

exactly my point, NOR DO YOU, you want us to agree to something and then later tell us what it will be, i can't believe you think that is sensible.
thanks for the great line though, i think i'll use it.

tim

 

[findtim]

due to changes with .nz and .uk there is more support.

support ! from WHO ? certainly not from the thousands of domain name owners you haven't told so that do not get a chance to have their say because you know they won't say " ohh yeh sure, cost me more money "
i don't give a hoot about .nz or .uk , go ask the real stakeholders which is the dentist, the pub, the mechanic.
tim

 

[David Goldstein]

Can you provide some links to evidence please?

For .fr, I interviewed the AFNIC CEO in 2011 and he told me:
"Thanks for giving me the opportunity to talk about .FR and AFNIC. There are several factors which can explain this tremendous growth – nearly 30 per cent per year for the last five years.

"Ever since individuals were allowed to register .FR domain names, individuals have accounted for 50 per cent of new registrations and they now represent 40 per cent of all registrants."

This year I contacted AFNIC again and I was told individuals have continued to represent around 50% of all registrants but with a slight decrease in "legal entities" since the GFC began.

Prior to 2011 individuals had their own failure of a 2LD, .nom.fr from memory.

In .SE they have a Domain Pirate <https://www.iis.se/english/blog/success-for-domain-pirate-campaign/> campaign where they have given away 10,000 .se domains to individuals. Compare that to a promotion for .id.au where domains were practically given away and total registrations declined from memory.

 

[David Goldstein]

support ! from WHO ? certainly not from the thousands of domain name owners you haven't told so that do not get a chance to have their say because you know they won't say " ohh yeh sure, cost me more money "
i don't give a hoot about .nz or .uk , go ask the real stakeholders which is the dentist, the pub, the mechanic.
tim

So in other words you're not interested in experiences around the world that could show the success. You want to stick with the system as is because it suits you. And as I've shown individuals do want to register domain names. The circumstances of each ccTLD are different of course, but the demand is there.

 

[David Goldstein]

exactly my point, NOR DO YOU, you want us to agree to something and then later tell us what it will be, i can't believe you think that is sensible.
thanks for the great line though, i think i'll use it.

tim

Of course I don't. Why should this be an issue? It's like the Republican referendum. People should have been asked do they want to become a republic or something similar - yes or no. Then the model should have been debated and decided. Unless you ask people do they want the change, or not and then decide there will never be change. But then, this is what you want.

 

[Andrew Wright]

For .fr, I interviewed the AFNIC CEO in 2011 and he told me:
"Thanks for giving me the opportunity to talk about .FR and AFNIC. There are several factors which can explain this tremendous growth – nearly 30 per cent per year for the last five years.

"Ever since individuals were allowed to register .FR domain names, individuals have accounted for 50 per cent of new registrations and they now represent 40 per cent of all registrants."

This year I contacted AFNIC again and I was told individuals have continued to represent around 50% of all registrants but with a slight decrease in "legal entities" since the GFC began.

Prior to 2011 individuals had their own failure of a 2LD, .nom.fr from memory.

In .SE they have a Domain Pirate <https://www.iis.se/english/blog/success-for-domain-pirate-campaign/> campaign where they have given away 10,000 .se domains to individuals. Compare that to a promotion for .id.au where domains were practically given away and total registrations declined from memory.

So no links to hard stats then?

 

[findtim]

you keep talking " individuals" , i'm talking talking businesses which some use their own name, this conversation has absolutely nothing to do with johnsmith being disadvantaged via an ABN clause and you know so stop with the charade, its got boring.

Unless you ask people do they want the change,

thanks for agreeing with me, lets go ask them, the thousands of business owners that don't know about it.
once again, i'm ok with change, but lets make the decision based on ........to use your words......... a referendum, a few hundred people didn't get told there was going to be one, the whole country was told, so lets tell all domain name owners, simple

tim

 

[Bacon Farmer]

Do you have defensive vs complete noob registrations in the new tld's.

Let's have the .uk and .nz evidence thanks oh you have anecdotal evidence from the French auDA equivalent CEO well that's fine then.

So really the only hard evidence is that id.au's are declining. You are a joke.

 

[Bacon Farmer]

This shows demand. It also shows the only strong area is the.com.au version and you want to stuff it up by dividing it in half and selling the new part back to the original owners. That only achieves extra income for those that sell it.

 

[findtim]

So really the only hard evidence is that id.au's are declining.

so individuals are giving up on .id.au , hmmmm, well they must be going somewhere, maybe to register a FREE ABN and get a .com.au
tim

 

[David Goldstein]

So no links to hard stats then?

The stats are on the AFNIC website for .fr and if you bothered to follow the link you would see that IIS provided stats for .se.

 

[David Goldstein]

so individuals are giving up on .id.au , hmmmm, well they must be going somewhere, maybe to register a FREE ABN and get a .com.au
tim

Or given that Australians rank highly with registrations on .me and .co, I'd say they're going there...

 

[David Goldstein]

View attachment 278

This shows demand. It also shows the only strong area is the.com.au version and you want to stuff it up by dividing it in half and selling the new part back to the original owners. That only achieves extra income for those that sell it.

Given that registrars don't make much money from selling domains but make money from add-on services such as hosting, it's not likely they will make money. Talk to one of the larger registrars and learn about their business. I'm not sure what demand you want to show. It doesn't show unmet demand. It just shows current use.

 

[David Goldstein]

Do you have defensive vs complete noob registrations in the new tld's.

Let's have the .uk and .nz evidence thanks oh you have anecdotal evidence from the French auDA equivalent CEO well that's fine then.

So really the only hard evidence is that id.au's are declining. You are a joke.

View attachment 277

Oh gee. Where's Andrew Wright to chastise you? Oh. That's right. You're talking bollocks so it's OK. But of course, you could check the stats on the AFNIC website but then, that will only show I'm right. Or you could check the IIS website. Or you could check the DNC website stats which would show second level .nz domains are the only ones showing an increase in registrations of any note. Most of the rest are declining including .co.nz. But gee. You wouldn't want stats would you.

 

[snoopy]

so individuals are giving up on .id.au , hmmmm, well they must be going somewhere, maybe to register a FREE ABN and get a .com.au
tim

If they are not really in business I think they'd just get a .com, they'd need to be very motivated and have a lot of time on their hands to get an ABN just to get a domain. Of course the obvious solution is not .au, the way to fix it is by freeing up all the .com.au red tape.

Regarding .id.au, this is classic AUDA, who would ever think that .id.au would be a good idea? I only every heard of one person using it, Josh Rowe. Seems even he has moved to a .com now looking at Google.

 

[findtim]

Or given that Australians rank highly with registrations on .me and .co, I'd say they're going there...

cool, so no need to inflict defensive registrations on australian small business, after all you said this was not a profit exercise.
tim

Given that registrars don't make much money from selling domains

do you keep forgetting that a fee is a fee to a business,

learn about their business

how about you learn about the average joe's business ? NOBODY in business says " ohh it cost me $25 but at least they didn't make a profit "
tim

show second level .nz domains are the only ones showing an increase in registrations of any note

once again, defensive registrations, business effectively being forced to spend more money.
don't come back with "nobodies being forced" , psychological abuse is abuse, this is a "do it or else" situation which adds nothing to anyone except anyone collecting the money, plain and simple
tim

 

[Andrew Wright]

The stats are on the AFNIC website for .fr and if you bothered to follow the link you would see that IIS provided stats for .se.

David, you keep quoting "evidence" but providing none - where is the back up for your argument in terms of hard facts?

You've provided some anecdotal evidence (without a link) and a link to a free domain promotion.

And all the .se link proves is that if you give away something for free, people will take it just because it's free - 17,000 .be domains on the first day for example (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.be)