Nominet proposes shorter .uk domains

[findtim]

well it seems we are the only 2 people willing to state each case ! ...disappointing or maybe just the time of day?

i agree to disagree with you and hope someone else enters the debate otherwise this is just a turntable, hopefully this will continue tomorrow

tim

 

[Blue Wren]

I never understand why "domainers" are promoting the drop auctions.. it's just stupid to me.

It's a great way for me to learn, and to promote it publicly is a bit of informative fun. You think it's stupid? Fine.

 

[findtim]

You yourself have posted about a friend you talked to now outbidding you on your niche and had a whinge he was hitting on your turf.

fair call but he was already in the domain name game, jst not a dnt member

tim

 

[findtim]

i need to put a foot note in here, sorry, for some reason my computer is not refreshing as usual so i am actually missing posts and then later finding the time stamps appearing ?? before mine, which means sometimes i am responding without full information. not an excuse just a reality for me today, sorry.

i'll talk to admin about it, if anyone else is having this issue please let admin know.

tim

 

[findtim]

I think mostly countries use whatever was created initially, and the countires who have implemented shorter versions have an uncomfortable split between the two and a weak namespace, eg india and china.

agreed

I don't see how or why auda could justify giving .com.au owners first go. How about they give .net.au owners first go? After all these poor people are the ones who have had to live with a terrible domain.

does that go against EVERYTHING you have ever written on dnt or was it a typo?

A big chunk of names worth anything would go to competition in my view.

YEP

I think there would be a whole lot of money spent (wasted) on .net.au perhaps, then a whole lot of auctions, with the end result being a halving of value of existing names and an overall weaker namespace.

YEP

Lots more reg fees being paid though, and likely a lot of auction money. How money grubbing is AUDA......time will tell.

YEP, i think the .net.au would die, it would be interesting to see a case study of what has hapened in other countries that have converted NOT originally went to straight " .au"

tim




tim

 

[Ash]

Not sure how best to handle it, but I think there might be a few more cases like this one where both parties miss out and it goes to the drops...

Edit for clarification: I mean whoever is granted the .au domain will probably have it contested by the other party (be it .com.au or .net.au owner) and the resolution would be the same as aforementioned Leader.com.au case, whereby both parties miss out and it goes to the drops to decide.

 

[FirstPageResults]

Ive also been wondering how disputes would be affected

 

[johno69]

It's a great way for me to learn, and to promote it publicly is a bit of informative fun. You think it's stupid? Fine.

I wasn't targeting you specifically. It's just the same as creating a great business model where you can make some money, then to go and publish it in the newspaper and the next week wonder why you are not making money from it any more.

I agree it's great to see the value of end user sales being promoted, but answer this...

There's a car for sale on a street corner that is valued to you the end user at about $20k. But the for sale sign on it is $5k and you are going to buy it for sure, but the owner says i'll not sell until 1pm tomorrow.

Do you promote this to everyone you can find? Knowing that if you do others will be there at 1pm and offer more and you miss out.

So yes I do think it's stupid, unless you have no intention to buy from the drops ever.

Not stupid for NF or DROP to promote them as it's their profit margin that grows with more bidders.

Sorry for being off topic.

 

[DavidL]

I wasn't targeting you specifically. It's just the same as creating a great business model where you can make some money, then to go and publish it in the newspaper and the next week wonder why you are not making money from it any more...

I know what you're saying but it's not that simple. More people on the drops means more competition and higher prices sure.

But, it also breeds more interest in domains and activity generally giving a greater chance for selling domains. After all, even if you hoarded thousands of great domains for a pittance you don't actually make any money until you sell them (or develop I guess).

Also, as we all know, prices of .au domains have tripled in the last two years and anyone who has held domains for this time has made money (on paper anyway). Would that have happened if the drops were hush, hush? I don't think so. In the days of 'invite only' private domainwatch auctions, I don't think values changed at all really.

I guess the ideal scenario would be to stimulate activity, mainstream interest, new domainers and end-users outside of the drops however that's hard to do - the drops is where the action is. Maybe the growing AMA might be an alternative? At any rate any new players will soon find their way to the drops anyway.

 

[johno69]

At any rate any new players will soon find their way to the drops anyway.

Yes this is true and I concede this. But if we manage to pick up a shit hot name today for a bargain then that's one in our pockets not others.

 

[Blue Wren]

I wasn't targeting you specifically. It's just the same as creating a great business model where you can make some money, then to go and publish it in the newspaper and the next week wonder why you are not making money from it any more.

I agree it's great to see the value of end user sales being promoted, but answer this...

There's a car for sale on a street corner that is valued to you the end user at about $20k. But the for sale sign on it is $5k and you are going to buy it for sure, but the owner says i'll not sell until 1pm tomorrow.

Do you promote this to everyone you can find? Knowing that if you do others will be there at 1pm and offer more and you miss out.

So yes I do think it's stupid, unless you have no intention to buy from the drops ever.

Not stupid for NF or DROP to promote them as it's their profit margin that grows with more bidders.

Sorry for being off topic.

I knew that you probably weren't targeting me specifically but you did ask me a Q recently regarding this.

I can't argue with what you say and you can have your opinion.

In answer to your question... One who shows their trump card is a fool.

 

[findtim]

Not sure how best to handle it, but I think there might be a few more cases like this one where both parties miss out and it goes to the drops...

Edit for clarification: I mean whoever is granted the .au domain will probably have it contested by the other party (be it .com.au or .net.au owner) and the resolution would be the same as aforementioned Leader.com.au case, whereby both parties miss out and it goes to the drops to decide.

leader is a good example of what shouldn't happen, thats just a whimp out and basically we are back into a bidding war, the problem is this will occur for thousands of names all at the same time, who's going to handle all that paperwork?

once again great for drop/netfleet ( no disrespect) , honestly who here has gone and bought the .net.au when the .com.au has been avaialble? nobody ! it stands to reason that the .com.au owner has the right to the .au if it ever comes and also their should be no money paid.

or in the case of the .xxx you can submit that the .au is not available for release.

but then if we think .net.au is harder to rank how is google going to treat it?

i say let the UK go off and sort out the issues, we sit back for the next 10-15years and wait for the answer, it took them 20 years to create the EU and less time to destroy it ! why do we need to be the guinea pig.

tim

 

[DavidL]

net.au and com.au are equal in policy. What the market, Google or anyone else has to say about it is irrelevant. Policy is all that registrants have to go on when choosing their domains.

I think you would have a period where the com.au and the net.au get a chance to express their interest in the .au for a standard reg fee. If only one responds then they get it. If both respond it's a 2-person auction with proceeds going to auDA.

If neither respond it goes into the general list for open registration at a later date.

One thing to note is that if this were the case, and if you believed that .au would eventually overtake com.au as the preferred extension, is that buying net.au's today might be a shrewd move. For 1/10th of the price it gives you an equal chance to get the .au at some stage in the future (note the two if's in that statement)

 

[findtim]

I think you would have a period where the com.au and the net.au get a chance to express their interest in the .au for a standard reg fee. If only one responds then they get it. If both respond it's a 2-person auction with proceeds going to auDA.

that is only going to work for low value domains like "dubbodentist" maybe, its not going to work for carsales.com.au, lets use them as the platform, they have a domain, they have spent zillions developing and promoting it and your saying if they don't own the .net.au then someone else has an equal right to it?

now they probably own the .net.au but think of thousands of businesses that don't, as an example cairns weddings dot com au , kay is a client and she got in REAL early, good on her, someone has the .net .au and its not developed, they have the net.au because they couldn't get the com.au ( which negates johno69's excuse that businesses where told to register .net.au) so this sole trader will have to go into a bidding battle for the new .au?
ridiculous !

One thing to note is that if this were the case, and if you believed that .au would eventually overtake com.au as the preferred extension, is that buying net.au's today might be a shrewd move. For 1/10th of the price it gives you an equal chance to get the .au at some stage in the future (note the two if's in that statement)

great, so lets all go out and double our expenses because of something that might happen? i was about to say " fine if you own 1 domain " but then thought " i do not want to go ring up my clients and hit them up for more money , which would be insurance money really, that sucks

tim

 

[johno69]

( which negates johno69's excuse that businesses where told to register .net.au) so this sole trader will have to go into a bidding battle for the new .au?
ridiculous !

You sure know how to twist peoples words around and talk some total crap. I've just read back over what I said and at no time did I say what you are again misquoting me on.

It's a fact tim, maybe this was before you knew the world wide web was even there.

.COM was for commercial businesses
.NET was for internet businesses
.ORG was for organisations

But as it's been said time and time again, .com.au & .net.au are the same when it comes to policy. If you for one minute think a large business like carsales would not secure the .net.au then you're more silly than I thought.

You are talking about being scared to suggest your clients spend $20 on protecting their name? Now i've heard it all.

If you think it's ok to run off and register all the .net.au's of well know businesses in an effort to underhandedly make a grab at the .au then you are slimy and will be caught out in the end.

I'm just saying, it's not automatic that it should be handed over to the .com.au owner.

My example exactly, whirlpool.au, who gets it?

Any major brand would have other measures in place to protect their name anyway.

 

[johno69]

My view has been heard on this so i'll leave it at that. I can't see much change happening here in a while anyway and by then I hope to be not worrying about ones and zeros.

 

[findtim]

You sure know how to twist peoples words around and talk some total crap. I've just read back over what I said and at no time did I say what you are again misquoting me on.

It's a fact tim, maybe this was before you knew the world wide web was even there.

.COM was for commercial businesses
.NET was for internet businesses
.ORG was for organisations

well it seems no one paid attention to those rules, or as the game changed realestate dot com au was registered over 20 years ago and it was an ONLY online business model.

But as it's been said time and time again, .com.au & .net.au are the same when it comes to policy. If you for one minute think a large business like carsales would not secure the .net.au then you're more silly than I thought.

policy hasn't dictated value

You are talking about being scared to suggest your clients spend $20 on protecting their name? Now i've heard it all.

do you charge your clients wholesale on domains you manage for them? i don't.

If you think it's ok to run off and register all the .net.au's of well know businesses in an effort to underhandedly make a grab at the .au then you are slimy and will be caught out in the end.

actually i said i would NEVR DO THAT.

I'm just saying, it's not automatic that it should be handed over to the .com.au owner.

solved, we agree to disagree

Any major brand would have other measures in place to protect their name anyway.

yes, but the decision affects many people who don't know, who i'm sure they will wake up a year later and say " they did what? changed it to .au so my competitor down the road now owns my domain name..."

tim

 

[Rhythm]

policy hasn't dictated value

But value should dictate policy?

 

[findtim]

But value should dictate policy?

ouch, now thats a topic by itself

tim

 

[johno69]

do you charge your clients wholesale on domains you manage for them? i don't.

Yes I do.