Extending .nz domain space

[findtim]

Who cares about google? Nor should Google be considered in issues of this sort.

newTLDs will be created, whether they like it or not. If their systems and bots and algorithm cannot handle it, so be it.

They are building their own walled garden anyway with G+ so like I said, who cares.

how on earth can you say " who cares about google" ?

if this comes to australia then everyone is going to care about google and what it means, google is god unfortunately and if they decide that .au is more important then .com.au then shit will hit the fan.

funnily it will just mean more business for guys like me but my core feeling is it isn't fair.

i don't want to be going to my client who owns "blablatowndentist.com.au" and saying " hey john.... you need to buy the .net.au even though its worthless so then you can buy the new .au without to many hassles and thats a throwaway item anyway, but google has now decided that the .au is more important so we are going to have to move your site to the new domain and hope that we keep our rankings but we can't afford to loose the ones we currently have so we should keep the .com.au site online but then google might penalise us for duplicate content? so who knows ... sorry but here's my bill and i can't promise you anything, but if you do not take my advice then your competitor down the road can go and register the .au domain ( which he's been pissed off he doesn't own your domain for the past 5 years) and might just rank higher then you meaning you will loose business but thats ok as what we will do is sue them for "passing off" which will cost your thousands$$$ of course but thats just business, but best you use a domain name specialist lawyer and i happen to know a few ( and i'm sure i can get a commission) so give this guy a call, HEY yeh, i know you have trusted me all these years but its not my fault, so guy in a deadend public service job came up with the idea and F^*&K'd the whole country.

ohhh, by the way i also know a good printer ( which i can get a commission off as well) "

tim

 

[snoopy]

Because it brings .au in line with other major gTLDs:

.eu
.in
.cn


.etc

Firstly none of those are gtlds.

Secondly why is moving "in line" with certain countries important? Surely those countries are "out of line" with .co.uk, .com.br etc?

To take the .cn example according to alexa there is 4 .cn sites in the top 50 versus 5 .com.cn so what does it really achieve? At the end of the day they have no strong country code domain.

http://www.alexa.com/topsites/countries;0/CN

.in is similar 2 .co.in, 2 .in.

http://www.alexa.com/topsites/countries;1/IN

Compare it to .com.au with 15 .com.au's in the top 50,

http://www.alexa.com/topsites/countries;0/AU

Do the people running those cctlds (.cn, .in, .eu) really have a clue what they are doing in terms of running a strong country code? Looking at the score board it would appear not. Compare that to .co.uk, .com.br, .com.au, .de where the structure has not been messed with.....Don't get me started on the repackaged basket case that is .us, we'll be here all night.

My conclusion: History suggests that it is always a bad idea to bring in a new country code extension.

 

[Rhythm]

how on earth can you say " who cares about google" ?

Google (nor Facebook) are not the internet.

if this comes to australia then everyone is going to care about google and what it means, google is god unfortunately and if they decide that .au is more important then .com.au then shit will hit the fan.

Other than for localisation google does not differentiate between the variation in TLDs.

funnily it will just mean more business for guys like me but my core feeling is it isn't fair.

Google doesn't care which SEO horse wins the organic race just so long as they get to put their 10 or so AdWords horses in front of yours.

 

[findtim]

Google (nor Facebook) are not the internet.



Other than for localisation google does not differentiate between the variation in TLDs.



Google doesn't care which SEO horse wins the organic race just so long as they get to put their 10 or so AdWords horses in front of yours.

if googles not the internet then who is?

local: true, but you missed my point on the effects of adding another extension LOCAL into the mix

seo: true but you missed my point on the costs involved in maintaining the organics listing ( even though it looks like that could soon be dead the way google is heading )

tim

 

[Rhythm]

Firstly none of those are gtlds.

edit: ccTLD

Secondly why is moving "in line" with certain countries important? Surely those countries are "out of line" with .co.uk, .com.br etc?

Majority. That's like 3 billion of the world's population, more or less.

It just looks more professional brandwise and shorter and easier to say and won't lead to emails being sent to the wrong person:

eg:

auda.com.au could unknowingly be losing emails to @auda.com

auda.net.au could unknowingly be losing emails to @auda.net

ditto with .gov.au, .org.au etc which I think is a serious problem.

Wayward type-in traffic can leak, but (sensitive) emails shouldn't.

Not entirely sure what you are trying to say with your Alexa links?

Rest of your post is just conjecture - not unlike most of your posts.

 

[findtim]

rhythm grab a beer mate !

AS it stands its a well ordered filing system take away the .com in .com.au and you destroy the system

.gov.au works, .org.au works. etc etc

i'm all for change but this is a piece of bureaucratic Sh^t

tim

 

[Rhythm]

if googles not the internet then who is?

That's a good question. Almost a riddle.

local: true, but you missed my point on the effects of adding another extension LOCAL into the mix

It will have to rank just like the rest. Presumably based on content.

seo: true but you missed my point on the costs involved in maintaining the organics listing ( even though it looks like that could soon be dead the way google is heading )

Not a problem for the TLD operators.

 

[Rhythm]

Now that I think about it the .nz came up with an reasonable compromise in their solution.

If as a .SLD.nz owner you have no competing .SLD.nz equivalent, you get your .nz during Sunrise. So no problems there.

If there are multiple .SLD.nz owners then they all have to agree like the musketeers on:

'All for one': They all agree that one of them gets the .nz (How on earth is that even possible?)

or one for all: They all agree as one on a new SLD (elegant solution, but still not as nice as having the .nz one would think)

otherwise: none for all - nobody gets the .nz

 

[snoopy]

Majority. That's like 3 billion of the world's population, more or less.

None are strong country codes. If it is 3 billion people, why follow them with their country code folly? Should we also try an emulate the European economy as well? Some things are not worth copying.

It just looks more professional brandwise and shorter and easier to say and won't lead to emails being sent to the wrong person:

eg:

auda.com.au could unknowingly be losing emails to @auda.com

auda.net.au could unknowingly be losing emails to @auda.net

ditto with .gov.au, .org.au etc which I think is a serious problem.

Wayward type-in traffic can leak, but (sensitive) emails shouldn't.

Not entirely sure what you are trying to say with your Alexa links?

Rest of your post is just conjecture - not unlike most of your posts.

It breaks the namespace in two. Talking about leakage, people in Australia rarely confuse .com.au for .com.

.au would be highly confusing because everyone knows .com.au.

 

[snoopy]

Not entirely sure what you are trying to say with your Alexa links?

The three examples you have given, europe, china and india are three examples of regions with weak cctlds, usage is low and a lot of local companies use .com. They probably should be looking at us rather than us copying them.

 

[Rhythm]

None are strong country codes. If it is 3 billion people, why follow them with their country code folly? Should we also try an emulate the European economy as well? Some things are not worth copying.

The folly was in having SLDs that imitated TLDs - leading to leaked traffic/emails. Both of which could lead to phishing (amongst other security concerns). With SLD's we're basically purchasing typodomains right of the dot.


If the European, Asians, Russians, Kiwi's (and I) have managed to figure this out, then what's taking so long for everyone else to figure this out. This isn't just about domaining and business - It's about personal/commercial/state security in terms of traffic and email. Domainers are harmless, all we do is park/resell domain names.

It breaks the namespace in two. Talking about leakage, people in Australia rarely confuse .com.au for .com.

Namespace is already broken into com.au, .net.au, .org.au, .id.au, .nsw.au, .qld.au, etc. re: leakage how do you know?

.au would be highly confusing because everyone knows .com.au.

Hence: Sunrise applications. therefore a non-issue.

Anyhow, I'm sure auDA will form a panel in due course if this ever comes up on the radar. That's enough from me.

 

[findtim]

It's about personal/commercial/state security in terms of traffic and email. Domainers are harmless, all we do is park/resell domain names.

i understand now why you are in this discussion, you just park/resell, can't you see how this will affect your portfolio?

i'm looking at it from my clients point of viewand its a HUGE change with many commercial ramifications

who will want to buy your parked " sydneytaxi.com.au" when they can just go register "sydneytaxi.au" or are you going to protect yourself like i have previously mentioned and register ... PAY... for the new domain?

your aguement is flawed

Namespace is already broken into com.au, .net.au, .org.au, .id.au, .nsw.au, .qld.au, etc. re: leakage how do you know?

rubbish, its totally logical and uniformed although .id and .name suck big time.

Hence: Sunrise applications. therefore a non-issue

BULL S%^T , even you have stated its a can of worms where nobody will agree on who gets it

" They all agree that one of them gets the .nz (How on earth is that even possible?)"

give it up and hope it never happens !

tim

 

[Rhythm]

Ok last post:

i understand now why you are in this discussion, you just park/resell, can't you see how this will affect your portfolio?

Zilch. I have 0 .nz domain names.

who will want to buy your parked " sydneytaxi.com.au" when they can just go register "sydneytaxi.au" or are you going to protect yourself like i have previously mentioned and register ... PAY... for the new domain?

Well, according to the .nz musketeer method, they won't be able to as they have put in place restrictions to protect original .SLD.nz holders.

rubbish, its totally logical and uniformed although .id and .name suck big time.

When I wrote 'broken' I meant 'fragmented'

 

[snoopy]

The folly was in having SLDs that imitated TLDs - leading to leaked traffic/emails. Both of which could lead to phishing (amongst other security concerns). With SLD's we're basically purchasing typodomains right of the dot.

I've never heard of any problems with that though. If there is any leakage it is tiny in my view. Not sure what you mean by typos.

If the European, Asians, Russians, Kiwi's (and I) have managed to figure this out, then what's taking so long for everyone else to figure this out.

The fact is .eu is not popular, .cn doesn't have a big share of the chinese market and it is split with .com.cn. A lot of chinese companies use .com. The cctlds that are popular are the originals that have been run well. .co.uk, .de, .com.au etc.

This isn't just about domaining and business - It's about personal/commercial/state security in terms of traffic and email. Domainers are harmless, all we do is park/resell domain names.

Again, never heard of anyone complaining of security issues because of the .com.au extension.

Namespace is already broken into com.au, .net.au, .org.au, .id.au, .nsw.au, .qld.au, etc. re: leakage how do you know?

None of those extensions above are popular. Businesses choose .com.au and very rarely go with anything else.

 

[snoopy]

Hence: Sunrise applications. therefore a non-issue.

The majority of business in Australia won't participate in that, and a lot of new business won't choose to register both. They'll choose one or the other and I think it will get to a situation where there is no standard, like the Chinese situation, that isn't a good thing in my view.

 

[snoopy]

i understand now why you are in this discussion, you just park/resell, can't you see how this will affect your portfolio?

i'm looking at it from my clients point of viewand its a HUGE change with many commercial ramifications

who will want to buy your parked " sydneytaxi.com.au" when they can just go register "sydneytaxi.au" or are you going to protect yourself like i have previously mentioned and register ... PAY... for the new domain?

In terms of the aftermarket I think this would at least halve current values of .com.au's. The same demand is there, supply is split into two. You've got the exact same buyers, twice the supply and twice the holding costs. Would be wise to sell .com.au and buy .au if it came about (assuming the .com.au market didn't react down straight away anyway which is probably would).

 

[findtim]

In terms of the aftermarket I think this would at least halve current values of .com.au's. The same demand is there, supply is split into two. You've got the exact same buyers, twice the supply and twice the holding costs. Would be wise to sell .com.au and buy .au if it came about (assuming the .com.au market didn't react down straight away anyway which is probably would).

Well basically what we will be selling is "SETS"

i have "homeloans" ( .com.au, .au, .net.au ) all for 1 price

that will be the new market.

it will turn into a poker game, a kids "football" card swapping game, pokemon, your collection of antique elephants from indonesia !!!

hopefully ryhthm can see that ?

tim


i just had a little laugh at the people watching this thread and saying " i'm staying out of this one ! 2 dogs fighting a lion"

 

[snoopy]

Well basically what we will be selling is "SETS"

i have "homeloans" ( .com.au, .au, .net.au ) all for 1 price

that will be the new market.

Except for the .net.au part part. Agree though a lot of people will be doing that. I think it is all going to get mixed up though with most decent terms having two different owners, dropping at different times, won by different people etc. It would effect the overall attractiveness of au domains in my view.

 

[DavidL]

Makes sense.

(Why are the .NZers beating us to this? Kind of embarrassing. :/ )

Well it's hardly surprising when there's only a once every three year panel meeting to discuss major issues like this and the last one didn't result in one single change!

No major changes in 6 years is a long time by internet standards.

Firstly none of those are gtlds.

Secondly why is moving "in line" with certain countries important? Surely those countries are "out of line" with .co.uk, .com.br etc?

If co.uk and com.br could have their time again they would have gone with .uk and .br, for sure as would .au. Like Rhythm said it was a mistake in the first place.

The fact is .au has 4 less characters than .com.au and that's a big deal.

My conclusion: History suggests that it is always a bad idea to bring in a new country code extension.

Does it? In India, .in registrations outstrip co.in registrations big time (in was brought in many years afterwards) which obviously means the people prefer them. Same with .mx vs com.mx - the former came in late but will end up dominating because users like them. Taking domainer hats off, isn't this what ccTLD operators should be doing - trying to deliver a product that the population wants?

Don't forget the most successful ccTLDs like .nl, .de

Saying all that I'm not 100% convinced Australia should do the same...

 

[findtim]

"4 extra characters" , i still can't understand why the laptop i bought last year didn't have a ".com.au" button on the keyboard ??? i've got 2 "alt" buttons.

and even though if you hold down the ".com" button on an iphone the .com.au extension does appear as a selection but how do i change it to be the default??

if those 2 things were standards then it would help.

But i can just hear the conversations on the phone for YEARSSS after it changes to .au "yes, my website is blabladentist.au, no there's no .com just.au, yes they changed it, yes alot of people don't know about it, no that website on the .com.au isn't our dentist, no thats the other dentists address you have to go to the .au, no i don't know why they changed it, yes i think its silly as well, well thanks for calling and i'm sorry you are currently parked at the other dentist because you went to the wrong website, yes it would be embarassing and confusing to find a car park then drag the kids out of the car only to discover you were in the wrong place, thats ok i'll change your time and see you in 15 minutes, why didn't we own both domain names? well he owned his first and he didn't know they were changing it and we got this one before he did, ohh yes we've managed to steal loads of business from him as he did alot of advertising but now we rank higher"

tim