Grabbing a domain manually

[MozzaG]

I know this is going to sound quite naive but im keen to learn more in this area. In terms of grabbing domains how come i cant do this manually?

So from what i can gather there are two big companies Netfleet and Drop who dominate the market. I assume they have some sort of system which makes them quicker than everyone else. How do they do this?

 

[WG2010]

I'll admit that I tried a few times to do this. It's a waste of your time. Yes, I'm an idiot.

I'm assuming that they pre-fill registration out with the winners details so that the very second the domain drops, they can register it. I'm sure it's more detailed than that though.

When I register domain names by hand, there is usually a delay of a few minutes while waiting for confirmation. I'm guess as they're a registrar, they can do this much quicker and automated.

 

[Nova]

Yep, prefilled data helps immensely. Having a direct connection to AusRegistry (ie. being a registrar) doesn't hurt

You could try and prefill your details in a system like WHMCS - that would be far quicker than manual rego but slower than both drop and netfleet I imagine.

 

[James]

I have read alot about domain grabbers, the way it works is:

1. drop catching systems will get the domain by the millisecond as it drops, I think they even have like a extra few seconds before it goes to the public.
2. People who have it on back order then get the second dibs on the domain as backorder systems are milisecond.
3. When it drops to the public you have down to the seconds to get it by hand, I have actually got a few domains in like under age minute after it drops.

Really hand regging domains after they drop is very very very hard...

 

[FirstPageResults]

No way you can compete with drop catchers who have registry access unless their systems fail.

You are making POST requests in a web browser using slow scripting languages such as PHP.. and you are reliant on using a 3rd party registrar connection who may not be giving you priority accesss.

They are likely using native scripts to connect directly to the registry (Java or Perl I think) which run independently of the browser and can have multiple connections open at once.. each registrar can have 4 concurrent sessions (I think) and both .au drop catches are sharing connections from 5 seperate registrars.

manually beating drop catcher = fail

 

[Timmy]

manually beating drop catcher = fail

+1

 

[Ken]

Drop services use highly optimized applications, tuned to the byte code level. They poll the registry using all of the 5 connections on each registrar they control at the time each domain is scheduled to drop with many, many thousands of domain availability checks, and then when they detect that the domain has been purged from the registry, immediately send a pre-generated EPP command to create the domain for their respective winners.

Drop, Netfleet and DomainWatch all compete at this level, where the battle occurs in the sub millisecond time frames. They spend many thousands of dollars in development at the code level to jockey for that added advantage each day, and it's a continuing effort as they each try to outdo each other.

It's not conceivable that you can hand register faster than these guys with the systems that the other registrars use, even if you managed to hit the URL at exactly the correct microsecond. While the registrar you would be using is technically able to create the domain at the same time as a drop catcher, it is not optimized for drop catching. The delays it has between checking the domain and generating an XML EPP command, then sending it would lose you the domain.

The only way you would catch it is if no drop catcher is trying to catch that particular domain.

 

[Oz.]

I remember refreshing the WHOIS on a domain that I had won the Drop auction for, waiting to see which service caught the domain. I did the whois at the exact time of drop as the whois went from previous registrant details to "No Data Found" then next refresh to my details. That was a surprise.

 

[Vicstar]

I have hand reggd many a domain after the drop but of course could never beat it! (wouldn't even bother trying). I'd only hand reg afterwards if I stupidly answered my phone at drop time or totally missed my alarms (and if luck was on my side that no-one else wanted it).

A few months back, a particular domain I wanted dropped.. but was distracted & just missed it. After kicking myself, to my surprise, I noticed no one got it! I jumped in to hand reg, but the Whois showed it had a new owner... already? Without saying too much, it appears the new owner was related to one of the drop co's (possibly their systems admin etc) although not actually obtained via the drop! Too quick!!! Sob sob... so I just kicked myself a little more.

After much bruising, I continued to refresh whois whilst in shock.. then guess what? It became available again, 15 minutes later!!! Persistence?? Nah, just Luck..

 

[idbrokers]

"Drop catching" is a game of good luck.

Sure you could spend thousands of dollars connecting to the registry, developing the right script and finding a fast enough host, book in some domian names and cross your fingers.

My primary (uk) business is sourcing premium domain names, many of which I am fortunate enough to "catch".

That said, UK systems (Nominet) and AU systems (auDA) are completely different, I moved back out here 3 weeks ago and still finding out about .com.au. I joined NetFleet and Drop. Looking forward to understanding more of the process.

Chris

 

[maca]

First post here so please be gentle and all that...

Naive questions perhaps, so try to be kind:

1. I do wonder if all those dropped domains which are coming available, and if all the likely buyers are on forums like this, then after a cycle of 2 years are not all the interesting domains already snapped up?

2. Are the buyers driven by Google's keyword tool? It is not accurate at all which any AdWords manager would know?

Would love to be put down if I can learn from it!

Thanks

 

[Honan]

First post here so please be gentle and all that...

Naive questions perhaps, so try to be kind:

1. I do wonder if all those dropped domains which are coming available, and if all the likely buyers are on forums like this, then after a cycle of 2 years are not all the interesting domains already snapped up?

2. Are the buyers driven by Google's keyword tool? It is not accurate at all which any AdWords manager would know?

Would love to be put down if I can learn from it!

Thanks

1. Fortunately there appears to be a never ending supply of people who do not renew good names
2. maybe only someone new to Domaining would rely on Google's keyword tool. Most others rely on experience and what names are in their niche and price bracket. Of course I could be wrong . I don't think anyone really knows what drives the bidders, apart from maybe boredom.

And welcome to the forum
I hope nobody shoots you

 

[maca]

Thanks "i sold grandma" for the considered response

 

[Chris.C]

1. Fortunately there appears to be a never ending supply of people who do not renew good names

Surely the supply of quality must drop with time.

How has the more mature dot com expiring domain market faired over the years?

Also I imagine with the advent of the NF AMA system some of the better quality domains might end up there rather than just being dropped.

One thing is for sure - there has definitely been a bit of a dry spell for the last couple of weeks.

2. maybe only someone new to Domaining would rely on Google's keyword tool.

I'd be interested to know if there are many domainers out there that don't at least have the GKT as part of their due diligence process.

Most others rely on experience and what names are in their niche and price bracket. Of course I could be wrong.

GKST makes up a part of my due diligence before I buy a domain - that said the vast majority of domains I see on the expiry auctions in a day don't even make it to the GKT check part of due diligence. So from this perspective it's not all about the GKT stats - but they definitely help provide insight.

1. I do wonder if all those dropped domains which are coming available, and if all the likely buyers are on forums like this, then after a cycle of 2 years are not all the interesting domains already snapped up?

Will all the bargains be gone... probably, but I guess the buyers will onto the secondhand domain market.

 

[Honan]

Surely the supply of quality must drop with time.

How has the more mature dot com expiring domain market faired over the years?

Also I imagine with the advent of the NF AMA system some of the better quality domains might end up there rather than just being dropped.

One thing is for sure - there has definitely been a bit of a dry spell for the last couple of weeks.


I'd be interested to know if there are many domainers out there that don't at least have the GKT as part of their due diligence process.

GKST makes up a part of my due diligence before I buy a domain - that said the vast majority of domains I see on the expiry auctions in a day don't even make it to the GKT check part of due diligence. So from this perspective it's not all about the GKT stats - but they definitely help provide insight.

Will all the bargains be gone... probably, but I guess the buyers will onto the secondhand domain market.

There are still good .com/net/org names that drop
Expensive though
And the .au has the "advantage" of no expiry dates in the whois, making it even easier to forget to renew
I don't understand the comment about NF AMA system
If a name drops, it drops
NF have to compete to catch it
Perhaps someone else has an explanation as to why the dry spell
I can't remember what was happening 25 months ago or 49 months ago

 

[Chris.C]

I don't understand the comment about NF AMA system

A lot of drops are domains that people choose not to renew - not just forget to renew - as a result sometimes if people think their domain is decent without being amazing yet they have no real desire throw another $25 to re-register it they might opt to throw it on the NF AMA rather just let it drop.